Thanks. The subject of discussion for us has been Section 5 below and its application to corporate bodies (like Catholic Church). Some interpret Section 5 to say never put "Early works to 1800" after a corporate body, others that when there's a $x included the SH as a unit becomes a topic and can therefore be followed by "Early works to 1800."<br>
<br>-Kate<br><br><div class="gmail_quote">On Tue, Mar 10, 2009 at 12:33 PM, Deborah J. Leslie <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:DJLeslie@folger.edu">DJLeslie@folger.edu</a>></span> wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="border-left: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 0.8ex; padding-left: 1ex;">
<div link="blue" vlink="purple" lang="EN-US">
<div>
<p><span style="font-size: 11pt; color: rgb(92, 70, 118);">I don't know; I've never found the instructions that difficult
to understand, but suspect that a lot of catalogers are unaware that there is a
section in the subject cataloging manual exactly covering issues relating to
early works. Beware, especially, of following ESTC practice for guidance; they
put it on everything whether it's allowed or not. At the Folger, we use it for
printed materials whenever it applies and is allowed. And of course it appears
on thousands of records loaded directly from the ESTC that we have not yet
corrected. Personally, I disagree with the SCM about the passage of time being of
little consequence, except possibly directly with personal names and works of
belles lettres. But I still toe the line on this one. </span></p>
<p><span style="font-size: 11pt; color: rgb(92, 70, 118);"> </span></p>
<p><span style="font-size: 11pt; color: rgb(92, 70, 118);">Here's the pertinent parts of SCM H 1576:</span></p>
<p><span style="font-size: 11pt; color: rgb(92, 70, 118);"> </span></p>
<p><b>1. <i>General rule</i></b><i>.</i> Use the
subdivision –<b>Early works to 1800</b> as a free-floating form
subdivision under all appropriate headings, including those assigned to maps of
all types, to designate individual works written or issued before 1800.
For exceptions to this rule, see <a href="http://desktop.loc.gov/nxt/gateway.dll?f=qlhitlist$qlhitlist_x=Advanced$qlhitlist_vpc=first$qlhitlist_xsl=querylink.xsl$qlhitlist_sel=title;path;content-type;home-title$qlhitlist_d=%7Bscmshm%7D$qlhitlist_q=%5Bfield%20folio-destination-name:%27H%201576%20sec%205%27%5D$qlhitlist_md=target-id=H%201576%20sec%205" target="_blank">sec.
5</a>, below. </p>
<p><span style="font-size: 11pt; color: rgb(92, 70, 118);"> </span></p>
<p><span style="font-size: 11pt; color: rgb(92, 70, 118);"> </span></p>
<p><b><i>5. When to omit the subdivision</i></b><i>.</i>
Do not use the subdivision in situations for which the passage of time is of
little consequence, including the following:</p>
<p><a name="11ff1729ed9a5495_Scmsubj_10159"></a>· under
names of persons, corporate bodies (except for geographic names), or individual
works (except sacred works)</p>
<p><a name="11ff1729ed9a5495_Scmsubj_10160"></a>· historical
works; chronologies</p>
<p><a name="11ff1729ed9a5495_Scmsubj_10161"></a>· under
headings with dates, or period subdivisions; under headings with period
qualifiers, for example, <b>Science, Ancient</b></p>
<p><a name="11ff1729ed9a5495_Scmsubj_10162"></a>· works
of belles lettres; works about belles lettres</p>
<p><a name="11ff1729ed9a5495_Scmsubj_10163"></a> </p>
<p>If it should be necessary because of the special nature of
the material to make an exception to any of the above categories, establish the
particular heading-subdivision combination in the subject authority file.</p>
<p><a name="11ff1729ed9a5495_Scmsubj_10164"></a> </p>
<p>Omit the subdivision when cataloging a commentary on an
early work, when the commentary requires companion headings as described in <a href="http://desktop.loc.gov/nxt/gateway.dll?f=qlhitlist$qlhitlist_x=Advanced$qlhitlist_vpc=first$qlhitlist_xsl=querylink.xsl$qlhitlist_sel=title;path;content-type;home-title$qlhitlist_d=%7Bscmshm%7D$qlhitlist_q=%5Bfield%20folio-destination-name:%27H%201435%20sec%202%27%5D$qlhitlist_md=target-id=H%201435%20sec%202" target="_blank">H
1435, sec. 2</a>.</p>
<p> </p>
<p><a name="11ff1729ed9a5495_Scmsubj_10165"></a>Do not use this subdivision
under headings for musical compositions. For instructions on the use of
period subdivisions for musical compositions, see <a href="http://desktop.loc.gov/nxt/gateway.dll?f=qlhitlist$qlhitlist_x=Advanced$qlhitlist_vpc=first$qlhitlist_xsl=querylink.xsl$qlhitlist_sel=title;path;content-type;home-title$qlhitlist_d=%7Bscmshm%7D$qlhitlist_q=%5Bfield%20folio-destination-name:%27H%201160%27%5D$qlhitlist_md=target-id=H%201160" target="_blank">H
1160</a>.</p>
<p><span style="font-size: 11pt; color: rgb(92, 70, 118);"> </span></p>
<p><span style="font-size: 11pt; color: rgb(92, 70, 118);"> </span></p>
<p><span style="font-size: 11pt; color: rgb(92, 70, 118);"> </span></p>
<div style="border-style: solid none none; border-color: rgb(181, 196, 223) -moz-use-text-color -moz-use-text-color; border-width: 1pt medium medium; padding: 3pt 0in 0in;">
<p><b><span style="font-size: 10pt;">From:</span></b><span style="font-size: 10pt;">
<a href="mailto:dcrm-l-bounces@lib.byu.edu" target="_blank">dcrm-l-bounces@lib.byu.edu</a> [mailto:<a href="mailto:dcrm-l-bounces@lib.byu.edu" target="_blank">dcrm-l-bounces@lib.byu.edu</a>] <b>On Behalf Of </b>Kate
Moriarty<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Tuesday, 10 March, 2009 12:24<br>
<b>To:</b> DCRM Revision Group List<br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [DCRM-L] use of SD early works under SH Jesus Christ</span></p>
</div><div><div></div><div class="h5">
<p> </p>
<p style="margin-bottom: 12pt;">This is very helpful. The same
instructions for personal names applies to corporate names and we've had
several discussions at SLU about the use of "$v Early works to 1800"
with corporate headings that also have a $x, for instance, Catholic Church $x
Government or Catholic Church $x Doctrines. Some of the catalogers have been
leaving out the "$v Early works to 1800" in OCLC but inserting it in
our local system. OCLC practice varies. It makes sense to me, however, that the
SH with a $x would then be seen as a unit and could be considered topical, at
which point "$v Early works to 1800" would be authorized. It's a case
of cataloger's judgment but we would be grateful to hear how others proceed.<br>
<br>
-Kate</p>
<div>
<p>On Wed, Feb 25, 2009 at 8:54 AM, Nickeson, Walter <<a href="mailto:wnickeson@library.rochester.edu" target="_blank">wnickeson@library.rochester.edu</a>>
wrote:</p>
<p>I think that the combination of subfields "[personal
name] $x [subject subdivision]" can be considered, as a unit, to be a
"topical heading," and can therefore be followed by "$v Early
works to 1800." What isn't allowed is the simple combination
"[personal name] $v Early works to 1800." "Jesus
Christ--Passion" is a topic in a way that "Jesus Christ" is not.
Exactly how that is, perhaps someone else can explain.<br>
<br>
*****************************************<br>
Walter F. Nickeson, Catalog &<br>
Metadata Management Librarian<br>
Rush Rhees Library<br>
University of Rochester<br>
Rochester, NY 14627-0055<br>
<a href="mailto:wnickeson@library.rochester.edu" target="_blank">wnickeson@library.rochester.edu</a><br>
(585) 273-2326 fax: (585) 273-1032<br>
*****************************************</p>
<div>
<div>
<p style="margin-bottom: 12pt;"><br>
-----Original Message-----<br>
From: <a href="mailto:dcrm-l-bounces@lib.byu.edu" target="_blank">dcrm-l-bounces@lib.byu.edu</a>
[mailto:<a href="mailto:dcrm-l-bounces@lib.byu.edu" target="_blank">dcrm-l-bounces@lib.byu.edu</a>]
On Behalf Of <a href="mailto:silvanan@mptek.net" target="_blank">silvanan@mptek.net</a><br>
Sent: Tuesday, February 24, 2009 5:09 PM<br>
To: DCRM-L<br>
Subject: [DCRM-L] use of SD early works under SH Jesus Christ<br>
<br>
Simple question:<br>
Can the SD "Early works to 1800" be used under the SH Jesus<br>
Christ|Subdivision (Passion, Divinity. etc.)<br>
It is authorized under Jesus Christ|vBiography, but that seems to be the<br>
only one specified.<br>
Rules say not to use it under names of persons, but I'm not sure if that<br>
applies to notable religious figures<br>
and practice is inconsistent just about everywhere I've checked.<br>
<br>
Thanks<br>
-Silvana</p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<p><br>
<br clear="all">
<br>
-- <br>
Kate S. Moriarty, MSW, MLS | Rare Book Catalog Librarian |
Pius XII Memorial Library | <br>
Saint Louis University | 3650 Lindell Blvd . | St. Louis, MO
63108 | (314) 977-3098 (tel) | (314) 977-3108 (fax)
| <a href="mailto:moriarks@slu.edu" target="_blank">moriarks@slu.edu</a> |
<a href="http://libraries.slu.edu/" target="_blank">http://libraries.slu.edu/</a></p>
</div></div></div>
</div>
</blockquote></div><br><br clear="all"><br>-- <br>Kate S. Moriarty, MSW, MLS | Rare Book Catalog Librarian | Pius XII Memorial Library | <br>Saint Louis University | 3650 Lindell Blvd . | St. Louis, MO 63108 | (314) 977-3098 (tel) | (314) 977-3108 (fax) | <a href="mailto:moriarks@slu.edu">moriarks@slu.edu</a> | <a href="http://libraries.slu.edu/">http://libraries.slu.edu/</a><br>