<div dir="ltr"><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:georgia,serif;font-size:small">Not so sure about Deborah's suggestion as it stands, since it seems to be <i>defining</i> the term more narrowly than it should do. Maybe "... xylographic (woodcut)"--still far from perfect, since you have to know what the term means to understand that the parenthetical term specifies a subset. (By the way, has anyone in this discussion ever encountered wood-engraved text that wasn't part of a "graphic"?)</div>
<div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:georgia,serif;font-size:small"><br></div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:georgia,serif;font-size:small">What we're talking about is <i>xylographic text</i> (which sounds almost like a candidate for rbpri) not associated with pictorial content. A title page or other purely textual page printed wholly from a woodcut would be included in this category, along with isolated words set in a page with type. Pictorial woodcut or wood-engraved title pages, etc., being "graphics", can simply be referred to by those terms, just as we refer to equivalent intaglio (engraved and etched) or lithographic matter.</div>
<div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:georgia,serif;font-size:small"><br></div><div class="gmail_default" style="font-family:georgia,serif;font-size:small">We're often hampered by the imprecise use of terms by uninformed writers, and terminological ambiguities--"plate", anyone? A DCRM description is principally of interest to those who care about such a level of description and either know what the appropriate technical terms mean or will be motivated to look them up. Perhaps it <i>would</i> be useful to have 655 Xylographic text (Printing), with an informative scope note. - Richard</div>
</div><div class="gmail_extra"><br clear="all"><div><font face="'courier new', monospace">RICHARD NOBLE :: RARE MATERIALS CATALOGUER :: JOHN HAY LIBRARY</font><div><font face="'courier new', monospace">BROWN UNIVERSITY :: PROVIDENCE, R.I. 02912 :: 401-863-1187</font></div>
<div><span style="font-family:'courier new',monospace"><</span><a href="mailto:RICHARD_NOBLE@BROWN.EDU" style="font-family:'courier new',monospace" target="_blank">Richard_Noble@Br</a><span style="font-family:'courier new',monospace"><a href="http://own.edu" target="_blank">own.edu</a></span><span style="font-family:'courier new',monospace">></span></div>
</div>
<br><br><div class="gmail_quote">On Wed, Dec 18, 2013 at 9:23 AM, Nipps, Karen <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:nipps@fas.harvard.edu" target="_blank">nipps@fas.harvard.edu</a>></span> wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">
<div bgcolor="white" lang="EN-US" link="blue" vlink="purple">
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Book Antiqua","serif";color:#1f497d">I was just about to agree with Erin, but I like your compromise.<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Book Antiqua","serif";color:#1f497d"><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Garamond","serif";color:#5f497a">Karen Nipps<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Garamond","serif";color:#5f497a">Head, Rare Book Team<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Garamond","serif";color:#5f497a">Houghton Library<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Garamond","serif";color:#5f497a">Harvard University<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Garamond","serif";color:#5f497a">Cambridge, MA 02138<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Garamond","serif";color:#5f497a">Phone: <a href="tel:617-496-9190" value="+16174969190" target="_blank">617-496-9190</a><u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Garamond","serif";color:#5f497a">FAX: <a href="tel:617-495-1376" value="+16174951376" target="_blank">617-495-1376</a><u></u><u></u></span></p>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Book Antiqua","serif";color:#1f497d"><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
<div>
<div style="border:none;border-top:solid #b5c4df 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in">
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif";color:windowtext">From:</span></b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif";color:windowtext"> <a href="mailto:dcrm-l-bounces@lib.byu.edu" target="_blank">dcrm-l-bounces@lib.byu.edu</a> [mailto:<a href="mailto:dcrm-l-bounces@lib.byu.edu" target="_blank">dcrm-l-bounces@lib.byu.edu</a>]
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Deborah J. Leslie<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Wednesday, December 18, 2013 9:04 AM</span></p><div><div class="h5"><br>
<b>To:</b> DCRM Users' Group<br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [DCRM-L] Alternative to "xylographic"<u></u><u></u></div></div><p></p>
</div>
</div><div><div class="h5">
<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif";color:#993366">I would dispute how widely understood the term is by users, but how about:
<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif";color:#993366"><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif";color:#993366">500 The first word of the title is xylographic (printed from a wood block).<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif";color:#993366"><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#215868">Deborah J. Leslie, M.A., M.L.S. | Folger Shakespeare Library |
<a href="mailto:djleslie@folger.edu" target="_blank"><span style="color:#215868;text-decoration:none">djleslie@folger.edu</span></a> | <a href="tel:202.675-0369" value="+12026750369" target="_blank">202.675-0369</a> |
<a href="http://www.folger.edu" target="_blank">www.folger.edu</a></span><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#993366"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Georgia","serif";color:#993366"><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
<div>
<div style="border:none;border-top:solid #b5c4df 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in">
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif";color:windowtext">From:</span></b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif";color:windowtext">
<a href="mailto:dcrm-l-bounces@lib.byu.edu" target="_blank">dcrm-l-bounces@lib.byu.edu</a> [<a href="mailto:dcrm-l-bounces@lib.byu.edu" target="_blank">mailto:dcrm-l-bounces@lib.byu.edu</a>]
<b>On Behalf Of </b>William Hale<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Wednesday, 18 December, 2013 04:38<br>
<b>To:</b> <a href="mailto:dcrm-l@lib.byu.edu" target="_blank">dcrm-l@lib.byu.edu</a><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [DCRM-L] Alternative to "xylographic"<u></u><u></u></span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt">Quite. I'm all for discarding obfuscatory jargon, but there seems no reason to reject a term which is widely used and understood by our users, and for which there is no obvious substitute.<br>
<br>
--<u></u><u></u></p>
<pre>William Hale.<u></u><u></u></pre>
<pre><u></u> <u></u></pre>
<pre>Rare Books Department,<u></u><u></u></pre>
<pre>Cambridge University Library,<u></u><u></u></pre>
<pre>West Road, Cambridge CB3 9DR,<u></u><u></u></pre>
<pre>England.<u></u><u></u></pre>
<pre><u></u> <u></u></pre>
<pre>Telephone: <a href="tel:%28%2B44%29%20%280%291223%20333122" value="+441223333122" target="_blank">(+44) (0)1223 333122</a><u></u><u></u></pre>
<pre>Email: <a href="mailto:William.Hale@lib.cam.ac.uk" target="_blank">William.Hale@lib.cam.ac.uk</a><u></u><u></u></pre>
<p class="MsoNormal">On 18/12/2013 01:40, Erin Blake wrote:<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<blockquote style="margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt">
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">Good question. I'm surprised to discover that I'm coming down on the side of keeping "xylographic" (normally, I'm a big fan of the vernacular). Reasons for
keeping "xylographic": </span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p><u></u><span style="font-family:Symbol"><span>·<span style="font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"">
</span></span></span><u></u><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">It covers both "woodcut" [plank-side technique] and "wood engraving" [end-grain technique]; the terms are easily confused, but meaningful to specialists;
we don't want to have the same problem with wood cuts that we do with "metal cuts" in ESTC (where what are called "metal cuts" are almost always actually engravings, i.e. intaglio prints; metal cuts are a very rare form of illustration, printed in relief from
metal plates)</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p><u></u><span style="font-family:Symbol"><span>·<span style="font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"">
</span></span></span><u></u><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">The term "xylography" is widely used in the literature (enough so that on Friday, I overheard a professor making sure that his dissertation seminar
students understood it)</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p><u></u><span style="font-family:Symbol"><span>·<span style="font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"">
</span></span></span><u></u><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d"> It is understood by specialists to mean "graphic" in the sense "of or relating to the written or printed word" as opposed to "pictorial" (not just
when talking about title pages, but when talking about woodcuts: there are times when it's important to distinguish which words in a picture are cut from the block and which are set from type, since only the latter can easily be changed; it's a big deal in
the history of book illustration)</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p><u></u><span style="font-family:Symbol"><span>·<span style="font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"">
</span></span></span><u></u><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">It's an important distinction that would be lost in keyword searching and datamining (it's fine to read "title printed from wood block" if you're
looking for more information about a known book, but if you're studying printing history, you'll want to be able to search "xylograph*" </span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p><u></u><span style="font-family:Symbol"><span>·<span style="font:7.0pt "Times New Roman"">
</span></span></span><u></u><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">It's easily understood from the dictionary definition if someone doesn't know what it means.</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d"> </span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">Thanks for bringing it up!</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d"> </span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">Erin.</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d"> </span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d">--------------------------------------------------<br>
Erin C. Blake, Ph.D. | Interim Head of Collection Information Services and Cataloging; Curator of Art & Special Collections | Folger Shakespeare Library | 201 E. Capitol St. SE | Washington, DC 20003-1004 | office tel. <a href="tel:%2B1%20%28202%29%20675-0323" value="+12026750323" target="_blank">+1 (202) 675-0323</a> | fax:
<a href="tel:%2B1%20%28202%29%20675-0328" value="+12026750328" target="_blank">+1 (202) 675-0328</a> | <a href="mailto:eblake@folger.edu" target="_blank">eblake@folger.edu</a> |
<a href="http://www.folger.edu" target="_blank">www.folger.edu</a> | <a href="http://collation.folger.edu" target="_blank">collation.folger.edu</a></span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d"> </span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d"> </span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d"> </span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d"> </span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d"> </span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1f497d"> </span><u></u><u></u></p>
<div style="border:none;border-top:solid #b5c4df 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in">
<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"">From:</span></b><span style="font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"">
<a href="mailto:dcrm-l-bounces@lib.byu.edu" target="_blank">dcrm-l-bounces@lib.byu.edu</a> [<a href="mailto:dcrm-l-bounces@lib.byu.edu" target="_blank">mailto:dcrm-l-bounces@lib.byu.edu</a>]
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Noble, Richard<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Tuesday, December 17, 2013 4:06 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> DCRM Users' Group<br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [DCRM-L] Alternative to "xylographic"</span><u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"> <u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Georgia","serif"">I suppose the attraction of "xylographic" is that it corresponds semantically to "typographic". But we have "woodcut".</span><u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Georgia","serif""> </span><u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Georgia","serif"">How to phrase it? "First word is a woodcut", "First word is woodcut", "First word is printed from a woodcut block"? I ask, because in ordinary discourse there's a strong pictorial connotation
to "woodcut", where the technical term "xylographic" simply means "printed from wood", with the understanding that it's from a block, not wood type.</span><u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Georgia","serif""> </span><u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Georgia","serif"">Anyway, "woodcut"--or "wood engraving", if we're describing such a thing--does seem like the best candidate.</span><u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><br clear="all">
<u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Courier New"">RICHARD NOBLE :: RARE MATERIALS CATALOGUER :: JOHN HAY LIBRARY</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Courier New"">BROWN UNIVERSITY :: PROVIDENCE, R.I. 02912 :: <a href="tel:401-863-1187" value="+14018631187" target="_blank">401-863-1187</a></span><u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Courier New""><</span><a href="mailto:RICHARD_NOBLE@BROWN.EDU" target="_blank"><span style="font-family:"Courier New"">Richard_Noble@Br</span></a><span style="font-family:"Courier New""><a href="http://own.edu" target="_blank">own.edu</a>></span><u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal" style="margin-bottom:12.0pt"> <u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">On Tue, Dec 17, 2013 at 3:49 PM, Deborah J. Leslie <<a href="mailto:DJLeslie@folger.edu" target="_blank">DJLeslie@folger.edu</a>> wrote:<u></u><u></u></p>
<div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Georgia","serif"">In an effort to drop obscure vocabulary in catalog records, I'm casting about for another way to word a note on the fact that a word
or block of text is printed from a wood block instead of metal type. The ESTC uses it extensively: e.g.,
<a href="http://estc.bl.uk/S120001" target="_blank">http://estc.bl.uk/S120001</a></span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Georgia","serif""> </span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Georgia","serif"">Any suggestions?</span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-family:"Georgia","serif""> </span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#0070c0"> </span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:9.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#005ea4">Deborah J. Leslie, M.A., M.L.S. | Folger Shakespeare Library | 201 East Capitol St., S.E. | Washington,
D.C. 20003 | <a href="mailto:djleslie@folger.edu" target="_blank"><span style="color:#005ea4">djleslie@folger.edu</span></a></span><span style="color:#005ea4">
</span><span style="font-size:9.0pt;color:#005ea4">| <a href="tel:202.675-0369" target="_blank">
202.675-0369</a> | <a href="http://www.folger.edu/" target="_blank"><span style="color:#005ea4">http://www.folger.edu</span></a>
</span><span style="color:#005ea4"> </span><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif""> </span><u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
</div>
<p class="MsoNormal"> <u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</blockquote>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:14.0pt;font-family:"Palatino Linotype","serif""><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
</div></div></div>
</div>
</blockquote></div><br></div>