<div dir="ltr">We have a longstanding practice at the University of Minnesota Libraries of using holdings records for copy-specific notes, and we are an Alma/Primo library. We generally use 866 $z, though I wouldn't necessarily make that choice today if we were starting fresh, and at some point I would like to convert them to the more specific fields you mention. But that would be a big project, because we also have gift notes, notes on provenance, etc., so it would take a lot of parsing to get things into the proper type of note field. We often have multiple copies, within specific special collections, across different special collections, and in different campus libraries across our system, so putting all of that into the bib record can quickly become very messy and confusing to indicate which copy is being specified.</div><br><div class="gmail_quote"><div dir="ltr" class="gmail_attr">On Tue, May 3, 2022 at 12:47 PM Julianne Simpson <<a href="mailto:julianne.simpson@manchester.ac.uk">julianne.simpson@manchester.ac.uk</a>> wrote:<br></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0px 0px 0px 0.8ex;border-left:1px solid rgb(204,204,204);padding-left:1ex">
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span>Hi all,<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span>I am just catching up with this conversation. I have been thinking about this issue again recently, though more in relation to retrieving specific data from the three copy specific fields we use
– 561, 562 and 563. <u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span>Until 2013 we had no facility to create public notes in our item records. On moving to Alma this opened up the possibility of using holdings, in particular as the 561, 562 and 563 are defined in
MARC21 Holdings. However, I decided to stick with our established practice for the sake of consistency. As Karen mentioned, it isn’t always good for display if you have multiple copies but we do try to identify and group our copy notes where we can.<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span>I am still not entirely convinced that copy notes in holdings would be much improvement for display as they are likely to be a further click away, but I would be very interested to hear from anyone
who is using the holdings for detailed copy notes – especially Alma/Primo users.<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span>All the best, <u></u>
<u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span>Julianne<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black">Julianne Simpson l Collections and Discovery Manager l John Rylands Research Institute and Library l University of Manchester l 150 Deansgate l Manchester l M3 3EH l Tel +44 (0)161 275 8749 l
</span><span style="color:rgb(31,73,125)"><a href="mailto:julianne.simpson@manchester.ac.uk" target="_blank">julianne.simpson@manchester.ac.uk</a></span><span style="color:black"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black">John Rylands Research Institute and Library
<a href="https://www.library.manchester.ac.uk/rylands/" target="_blank"><span style="color:rgb(5,99,193)">https://www.library.manchester.ac.uk/rylands/</span></a><u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black">Follow our Special Collections Blog at
</span><span style="color:rgb(31,73,125)"><a href="http://rylandscollections.wordpress.com/" target="_blank">http://rylandscollections.wordpress.com</a><u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="color:black">Twitter @TheJohnRylands<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><a href="https://www.library.manchester.ac.uk/rylands/" target="_blank"><span style="color:windowtext;text-decoration:none"><img border="0" width="601" height="200" style="width: 6.2604in; height: 2.0833in;" id="gmail-m_-6450908390019536412Picture_x0020_1" src="cid:1808ef90c935b16b22"></span></a><u></u><u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span lang="EN-US">From:</span></b><span lang="EN-US"> DCRM-L <<a href="mailto:dcrm-l-bounces@lib.byu.edu" target="_blank">dcrm-l-bounces@lib.byu.edu</a>>
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Karen Attar<br>
<b>Sent:</b> 30 April 2022 20:42<br>
<b>To:</b> DCRM Users' Group <<a href="mailto:dcrm-l@lib.byu.edu" target="_blank">dcrm-l@lib.byu.edu</a>><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [DCRM-L] [EXTERNAL EMAIL] Re: Cataloging Question - how to catalog differences in publisher's bindings<u></u><u></u></span></p>
</div>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12pt;color:black">Thank you very much, Nick, for circulating this.<u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12pt;color:black"><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12pt;color:black">I see that we barely stated explicitly in the document that 563 was intended to be for copy-specific bindings; there's just a passing reference in C.1. As Deborah has pointed out, that was our
intention, though, and the $5 in the examples indicates our thinking. <u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12pt;color:black"><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12pt;color:black">I think in the old UK MARC code there was an example of a binding note applying to all copies of an edition (UK MARC 531, notes on physical elements of a record). We transferred that to a plain
500 when we moved across to MARC21.<u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12pt;color:black"><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12pt;color:black">I really like the Folger way of doing things. 561, 563, 590 are neat if one has only one copy of a title in a record. If one is dealing with several copies, it looks confusing to switch between
copies: "Copy 1 is from the library of Joe Bloggs. Copy 2 has the bookplate of Mary Smith. Copy 1 is bound in speckled calf with red edges and marbled endpapers. Copy 2 is bound in limp vellum. Copy 1 is imperfect, wanting the final (blank) leaf." Much clearer
for the user to have one paragraph per copy.<u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12pt;color:black"><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12pt;color:black">Best wishes,<u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12pt;color:black">Karen <u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:12pt;color:black"><u></u> <u></u></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US">Dr Karen Attar</span><span style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Tahoma,sans-serif"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US">Senate House Library, Univ. of London</span><span style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Tahoma,sans-serif"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US">Malet St</span><span style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Tahoma,sans-serif"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US">London</span><span style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Tahoma,sans-serif"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US">WC1E 7HU</span><span style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Tahoma,sans-serif"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="EN-US">020 7862 8472</span><span style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Tahoma,sans-serif"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="DE" style="font-size:10pt"><a href="http://research.sas.ac.uk/ies/fellow/516/dr-karen-attar/" target="_blank">http://research.sas.ac.uk/ies/fellow/516/dr-karen-attar/</a></span><span lang="DE"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span lang="DE"> <u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:8pt">The University of London is an exempt charity in England and Wales.</span><span style="font-size:10pt;font-family:Tahoma,sans-serif"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><b><span style="color:black">From:</span></b><span style="color:black"> DCRM-L <<a href="mailto:dcrm-l-bounces@lib.byu.edu" target="_blank">dcrm-l-bounces@lib.byu.edu</a>> on behalf of Nicholas Sparks <<a href="mailto:nicholas.a.sparks@gmail.com" target="_blank">nicholas.a.sparks@gmail.com</a>><br>
<b>Sent:</b> 30 April 2022 04:26<br>
<b>To:</b> DCRM Users' Group <<a href="mailto:dcrm-l@lib.byu.edu" target="_blank">dcrm-l@lib.byu.edu</a>><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [DCRM-L] [EXTERNAL EMAIL] Re: Cataloging Question - how to catalog differences in publisher's bindings</span>
<u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"> <u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">Hi,<u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">No doubt you’ve seen this, but for those who have not, I return again and again to this useful document: <u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">Guidelines for the Cataloguing of Rare Books.<u></u><u></u></p>
</div>
</div>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
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<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><a href="https://eur03.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fcdn.ymaws.com%2Fwww.cilip.org.uk%2Fresource%2Fgroup%2F6b7ad90b-bf8b-4d07-8406-0d28376b41f1%2Fguidlines_for_the_cataloguin.pdf&data=05%7C01%7CKaren.Attar%40london.ac.uk%7C78e7245ee7e146deb7fa08da2a595716%7C185280ba7a0042ea940819eafd13552e%7C0%7C0%7C637868860743812292%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C2000%7C%7C%7C&sdata=b0vDsh5HXQvEmN8Vlu7oiCxIO4z6TcJwDgNrku4Gb6k%3D&reserved=0" target="_blank">https://cdn.ymaws.com/www.cilip.org.uk/resource/group/6b7ad90b-bf8b-4d07-8406-0d28376b41f1/guidlines_for_the_cataloguin.pdf</a><u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
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<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">It gives some detail about use of 563 - but for clarifications, modification and extensions of theory and practice, I go to senior practitioners for precept and advice. <u></u><u></u></p>
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<div>
<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
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<div>
<p class="MsoNormal">Greetings from a lovely autumnal Adelaide,<u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">Nick <u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><u></u> <u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">On Sat, 30 Apr 2022 at 12:54 am, Deborah J. Leslie <<a href="mailto:DJLeslie@folger.edu" target="_blank">DJLeslie@folger.edu</a>> wrote:<u></u><u></u></p>
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<p><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12pt;font-family:Georgia,serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">I, too, would like to hear about use of the 563. We do not currently use it at the Folger.* It's my understanding that 563 was one of the UKMARC fields added when it merged
with USMARC to become MARC21, so Karen knows whereof she speaks. This is the 563 scope:
</span><span lang="EN-US">Binding information intended primarily for use with antiquarian materials, rare books and other special collections. </span><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12pt;font-family:Georgia,serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">It doesn't specify bespoke
bindings, but that does seem to be the intent. Looks like something has been lost in translation.
</span><span lang="EN-US"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12pt;font-family:Georgia,serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)"> </span><span lang="EN-US"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12pt;font-family:Georgia,serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">That said, is there a problem using it for both types? Bespoke bindings would presumably be identified as such by a $5—which at present is pretty much knowledge limited
to catalogers. </span><span lang="EN-US"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12pt;font-family:Georgia,serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)"> </span><span lang="EN-US"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12pt;font-family:Georgia,serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">*At the Folger, we've preferred to group all copy-specific information together in an 852$z rather than fragment it into separate fields. That may change as we bring up
a new ILS. </span><span lang="EN-US"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<p class="gmail-m_-6450908390019536412xmsonormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="color:rgb(31,73,125)">______________________________</span><span lang="EN-US"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="gmail-m_-6450908390019536412xmsonormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:10pt;color:rgb(94,50,124)">Deborah J. Leslie, MA, MLS | Senior Cataloger | Folger Shakespeare Library | 201 East Capitol St., SE, Washington, DC 20003 |
<a href="mailto:djleslie@folger.edu" target="_blank"><span style="color:rgb(5,99,193)">djleslie@folger.edu</span></a> |
<a href="https://eur03.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.folger.edu%2F&data=05%7C01%7CKaren.Attar%40london.ac.uk%7C78e7245ee7e146deb7fa08da2a595716%7C185280ba7a0042ea940819eafd13552e%7C0%7C0%7C637868860743812292%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C2000%7C%7C%7C&sdata=RQggTqEijnd%2FRchik6Oe8qIjGcWFDQF2b8h5WdlO%2BPM%3D&reserved=0" target="_blank">
<span style="color:rgb(5,99,193)">www.folger.edu</span></a></span><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:10pt;color:rgb(31,73,125)">
</span><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:10pt;color:rgb(94,50,124)">| Opinions her own</span><span lang="EN-US"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<p class="gmail-m_-6450908390019536412xmsonormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12pt;font-family:Georgia,serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)"> </span><span lang="EN-US"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<p class="gmail-m_-6450908390019536412xmsonormal"><b><span lang="EN-US">From:</span></b><span lang="EN-US"> DCRM-L <<a href="mailto:dcrm-l-bounces@lib.byu.edu" target="_blank">dcrm-l-bounces@lib.byu.edu</a>>
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Ann K.D. Myers<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Thursday, April 28, 2022 16:33<br>
<b>To:</b> DCRM Users' Group <<a href="mailto:dcrm-l@lib.byu.edu" target="_blank">dcrm-l@lib.byu.edu</a>><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [DCRM-L] [EXTERNAL EMAIL] Re: Cataloging Question - how to catalog differences in publisher's bindings<u></u><u></u></span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class="gmail-m_-6450908390019536412xmsonormal"><span lang="EN-US"> <u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<p class="gmail-m_-6450908390019536412xmsonormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12pt;color:black">Interesting; the practice we follow (and which I have observed being followed by at least some other institutions) is to use the 563 for bindings common to an issue, such as publishers'
bindings or artists' book bindings, and to use a local note (in our case the 590) for copy-specific bindings. I'd never seen that the 563 was intended for copy-specific bindings notes.</span><span lang="EN-US"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<p class="gmail-m_-6450908390019536412xmsonormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12pt;color:black"> </span><span lang="EN-US"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<p class="gmail-m_-6450908390019536412xmsonormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12pt;color:black">--Ann</span><span lang="EN-US"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
</div>
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<p class="gmail-m_-6450908390019536412xmsonormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12pt;color:black"> </span><span lang="EN-US"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<p class="gmail-m_-6450908390019536412xmsonormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12pt;color:black"> </span><span lang="EN-US"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<div id="gmail-m_-6450908390019536412x_m_1170193863176621426Signature">
<div>
<div id="gmail-m_-6450908390019536412x_m_1170193863176621426divtagdefaultwrapper">
<p style="background:white"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12pt;color:black">Ann K.D. Myers</span><span lang="EN-US"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p style="background:white"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12pt;color:black">Rare Books Cataloger</span><span lang="EN-US"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p style="background:white"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12pt;color:black">Stanford Libraries</span><span lang="EN-US"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p style="background:white"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12pt;color:black">Dept. of Special Collections and University Archives</span><span lang="EN-US"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p style="background:white"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12pt;color:black">415 Broadway, Floor 1, 8406</span><span lang="EN-US"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p style="background:white"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12pt;color:black">Redwood City, CA 94063</span><span lang="EN-US"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p style="background:white"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12pt;color:black"><a href="mailto:akdmyers@stanford.edu" target="_blank">akdmyers@stanford.edu</a></span><span lang="EN-US"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p style="background:white"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12pt;color:black">she/her/hers</span><span lang="EN-US"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<div class="MsoNormal" align="center" style="text-align:center"><span lang="EN-US">
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<div id="gmail-m_-6450908390019536412x_m_1170193863176621426divRplyFwdMsg">
<p class="gmail-m_-6450908390019536412xmsonormal"><b><span lang="EN-US" style="color:black">From:</span></b><span lang="EN-US" style="color:black"> DCRM-L <<a href="mailto:dcrm-l-bounces@lib.byu.edu" target="_blank">dcrm-l-bounces@lib.byu.edu</a>> on behalf of Karen Attar <<a href="mailto:karen.attar@london.ac.uk" target="_blank">karen.attar@london.ac.uk</a>><br>
<b>Sent:</b> Tuesday, April 26, 2022 3:31 AM<br>
<b>To:</b> DCRM Users' Group <<a href="mailto:dcrm-l@lib.byu.edu" target="_blank">dcrm-l@lib.byu.edu</a>><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [DCRM-L] [EXTERNAL EMAIL] Re: Cataloging Question - how to catalog differences in publisher's bindings</span><span lang="EN-US">
<u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<p class="gmail-m_-6450908390019536412xmsonormal"><span lang="EN-US"> <u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<p class="gmail-m_-6450908390019536412xm1170193863176621426xmsonormal">I’d use 500 for bindings common to an issue, 563 for bespoke bindings: 563 was devised as a copy-specific bindings note.<span lang="EN-US"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="gmail-m_-6450908390019536412xm1170193863176621426xmsonormal">Best,<span lang="EN-US"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="gmail-m_-6450908390019536412xm1170193863176621426xmsonormal">Karen<span lang="EN-US"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="gmail-m_-6450908390019536412xm1170193863176621426xmsonormal"> <span lang="EN-US"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<p class="gmail-m_-6450908390019536412xm1170193863176621426xmsonormal"><span lang="EN-US">Dr Karen Attar<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="gmail-m_-6450908390019536412xm1170193863176621426xmsonormal"><span lang="EN-US">Curator of Rare Books and University Art<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="gmail-m_-6450908390019536412xm1170193863176621426xmsonormal"><span lang="EN-US">Senate House Library, University of London<u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="gmail-m_-6450908390019536412xm1170193863176621426xmsonormal"><span lang="EN-US">Senate House<u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<p class="gmail-m_-6450908390019536412xm1170193863176621426xmsonormal"><b><span lang="EN-US">From:</span></b><span lang="EN-US"> DCRM-L <<a href="mailto:dcrm-l-bounces@lib.byu.edu" target="_blank">dcrm-l-bounces@lib.byu.edu</a>>
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Patrick Perratt<br>
<b>Sent:</b> 26 April 2022 09:50<br>
<b>To:</b> DCRM Users' Group <<a href="mailto:dcrm-l@lib.byu.edu" target="_blank">dcrm-l@lib.byu.edu</a>><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [DCRM-L] [EXTERNAL EMAIL] Re: Cataloging Question - how to catalog differences in publisher's bindings<u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<p class="gmail-m_-6450908390019536412xm1170193863176621426xmsonormal"> <span lang="EN-US"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<p class="gmail-m_-6450908390019536412xm1170193863176621426xmsonormal"><span style="font-size:12pt;color:black">Would you use 563 for describing publishers' bindings? Or just bespoke bindings? For variant publishers' bindings my inclination would have been to describe the known variations
in a 500 (e.g. "... issued in red and blue variant colourways ...") with a local note describing which variant(s) we hold. I have wondered about using 563 for publishers' bindings, but found the guidance rather vague. I would be interested to hear what others
are doing.</span><span lang="EN-US"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<p class="gmail-m_-6450908390019536412xm1170193863176621426xmsonormal"><span style="font-size:12pt;color:black">Patrick</span><span lang="EN-US"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<p class="gmail-m_-6450908390019536412xm1170193863176621426xmsonormal"><b><span style="color:black">From:</span></b><span style="color:black"> DCRM-L <<a href="mailto:dcrm-l-bounces@lib.byu.edu" target="_blank">dcrm-l-bounces@lib.byu.edu</a>> on behalf of Sarah Stanhope <<a href="mailto:sstanhop@gmail.com" target="_blank">sstanhop@gmail.com</a>><br>
<b>Sent:</b> 26 April 2022 03:19<br>
<b>To:</b> DCRM Users' Group <<a href="mailto:dcrm-l@lib.byu.edu" target="_blank">dcrm-l@lib.byu.edu</a>><br>
<b>Subject:</b> [EXTERNAL EMAIL] Re: [DCRM-L] Cataloging Question - how to catalog differences in publisher's bindings</span>
<span lang="EN-US"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
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</span></strong><span style="color:rgb(156,8,2)">This email originates outside the V&A. Do not click on links or attachments unless you recognise the sender and are expecting the links or attachments. If you are unsure, contact the sender to confirm that the email
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<p class="gmail-m_-6450908390019536412xm1170193863176621426xmsonormal">Hi Deborah, <span lang="EN-US"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<p class="gmail-m_-6450908390019536412xm1170193863176621426xmsonormal"> <span lang="EN-US"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<p class="gmail-m_-6450908390019536412xm1170193863176621426xmsonormal">Thank you for your advice on cataloging variant bindings. I am glad that you mentioned putting "different sizes on different records." The two items I was cataloging had examples of different sub-manifestations, but
there were also other related sub-manifestations that were of different sizes. Thank you for helping me to sort out the complexities that may arise from these variations in bindings. You answered the question that I wasn't quite sure how to ask!<span lang="EN-US"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<p class="gmail-m_-6450908390019536412xm1170193863176621426xmsonormal"> <span lang="EN-US"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<p class="gmail-m_-6450908390019536412xm1170193863176621426xmsonormal">With sincere appreciation,<span lang="EN-US"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<p class="gmail-m_-6450908390019536412xm1170193863176621426xmsonormal">Sarah<span lang="EN-US"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<p class="gmail-m_-6450908390019536412xm1170193863176621426xmsonormal"> <span lang="EN-US"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<p class="gmail-m_-6450908390019536412xm1170193863176621426xmsonormal"> <span lang="EN-US"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<p class="gmail-m_-6450908390019536412xm1170193863176621426xmsonormal"> <span lang="EN-US"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<p class="gmail-m_-6450908390019536412xm1170193863176621426xmsonormal">On Mon, Apr 25, 2022 at 11:41 AM Deborah J. Leslie <<a href="mailto:DJLeslie@folger.edu" target="_blank">DJLeslie@folger.edu</a>> wrote:<span lang="EN-US"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
</div>
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<p class="gmail-m_-6450908390019536412xm1170193863176621426xxmsonormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12pt;font-family:Georgia,serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">Although variant bindings would strictly speaking be considered different "issues," I concur with Madelene and Randal that it is
best to catalog them on the same record and make notes about differences. This is the approach taken by descriptive bibliographies, such as BAL. Either make a specific note about binding variants as is done on the OCLC record Randy mentions, or a general note
that there are binding variations, with specifics associated with particular copies. With 19c books increasingly cataloged according to rare material standards, and without definitive evidence from publishers' archives, you can't be sure you've got them all
described. </span><span lang="EN-US"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="gmail-m_-6450908390019536412xm1170193863176621426xxmsonormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12pt;font-family:Georgia,serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)"> </span><span lang="EN-US"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="gmail-m_-6450908390019536412xm1170193863176621426xxmsonormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12pt;font-family:Georgia,serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">Back when work was being done on DCRM2, the editorial group struggled to fit what we called "sub-expressions" or "sub-manifestations"
into the IFLA LRM. It became less pressing with the new RDA toolkit and the decision to present DCRMR as a stand-alone manual. Still, it's an interesting question, how to represent sub-expressions/manifestations in a MARC bibliographic record.
</span><span lang="EN-US"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="gmail-m_-6450908390019536412xm1170193863176621426xxmsonormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12pt;font-family:Georgia,serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)"> </span><span lang="EN-US"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="gmail-m_-6450908390019536412xm1170193863176621426xxmsonormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12pt;font-family:Georgia,serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)">OTOH, I would put manifestations with different sizes on different records. There's a pretty big difference between 16 cm and 20
cm. </span><span lang="EN-US"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="gmail-m_-6450908390019536412xm1170193863176621426xxmsonormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="color:rgb(31,73,125)">______________________________</span><span lang="EN-US"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="gmail-m_-6450908390019536412xm1170193863176621426xxmsonormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:10pt;color:rgb(94,50,124)">Deborah J. Leslie, MA, MLS | Senior Cataloger | Folger Shakespeare Library | 201 East Capitol St., SE, Washington, DC 20003 |
<a href="mailto:djleslie@folger.edu" target="_blank"><span style="color:rgb(5,99,193)">djleslie@folger.edu</span></a> |
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<span style="color:rgb(5,99,193)">www.folger.edu</span></a></span><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:10pt;color:rgb(31,73,125)">
</span><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:10pt;color:rgb(94,50,124)">| Opinions her own</span><span lang="EN-US"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
<p class="gmail-m_-6450908390019536412xm1170193863176621426xxmsonormal"><span lang="EN-US" style="font-size:12pt;font-family:Georgia,serif;color:rgb(31,73,125)"> </span><span lang="EN-US"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<p class="gmail-m_-6450908390019536412xm1170193863176621426xxmsonormal"><b><span lang="EN-US">From:</span></b><span lang="EN-US"> DCRM-L <<a href="mailto:dcrm-l-bounces@lib.byu.edu" target="_blank">dcrm-l-bounces@lib.byu.edu</a>>
<b>On Behalf Of </b>Randal S. BRANDT<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Saturday, April 23, 2022 16:43<br>
<b>To:</b> DCRM Users' Group <<a href="mailto:dcrm-l@lib.byu.edu" target="_blank">dcrm-l@lib.byu.edu</a>><br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: [DCRM-L] Cataloging Question - how to catalog differences in publisher's bindings<u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<p class="gmail-m_-6450908390019536412xm1170193863176621426xxmsonormal"><span lang="EN-US"> <u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<p class="gmail-m_-6450908390019536412xm1170193863176621426xxmsonormal"><span lang="EN-US">Hello Sarah,<u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<p class="gmail-m_-6450908390019536412xm1170193863176621426xxmsonormal"><span lang="EN-US"> <u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<p class="gmail-m_-6450908390019536412xm1170193863176621426xxmsonormal"><span lang="EN-US">I agree with Madelene that you will most likely want to catalog all copies on the same bibliographic record. When publisher's binding variants are significant, I usually make a note describing the
variants using a 500 note. However, I can see using a 563 for these types of notes, as well. If there is a published description of the variants, I will reference that description. Then, I use local notes to identify which of the variants is present in our
copy(ies). To see an example, look at OCLC# 2981235.<u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<p class="gmail-m_-6450908390019536412xm1170193863176621426xxmsonormal"><span lang="EN-US"> <u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<p class="gmail-m_-6450908390019536412xm1170193863176621426xxmsonormal"><span lang="EN-US">I have mostly encountered the need for these types of notes in records for 19th century American literature titles (Mark Twain, George Sterling, Walt Whitman, etc.). That seems to be a time period
when publishers (in the U.S. at least) were particularly fond of issuing books in a variety of bindings. <u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<p class="gmail-m_-6450908390019536412xm1170193863176621426xxmsonormal"><span lang="EN-US"> <u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<p class="gmail-m_-6450908390019536412xm1170193863176621426xxmsonormal"><span lang="EN-US">Randal<u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<p class="gmail-m_-6450908390019536412xm1170193863176621426xxmsonormal"><span lang="EN-US"> <u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<p class="gmail-m_-6450908390019536412xm1170193863176621426xxmsonormal"><span lang="EN-US"> <u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<p class="gmail-m_-6450908390019536412xm1170193863176621426xxmsonormal"><span lang="EN-US">On Sat, Apr 23, 2022 at 12:45 PM Madelene Kinraid <<a href="mailto:madelene.kinraid@gmail.com" target="_blank">madelene.kinraid@gmail.com</a>> wrote:<u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<p class="gmail-m_-6450908390019536412xm1170193863176621426xxmsonormal"><span lang="EN-US">Kia ora Sarah,<br>
<br>
I think keeping both/ all copies on the same record and recording the binding information in a 563 is perfect. You might need to assign copy numbers to differentiate, I would use a separate 563 to describe the binding of each copy. At our library I would add
the binding information in a 590 note, but that’s just our practice.<br>
<br>
Best wishes <br>
Madelene <br>
<br>
<br>
<br>
> On 24/04/2022, at 7:12 AM, Sarah Stanhope <<a href="mailto:sstanhop@gmail.com" target="_blank">sstanhop@gmail.com</a>> wrote:<br>
> <br>
> <br>
> Good Afternoon All, <br>
> <br>
> I have a cataloging question that is hopefully not too obvious. I have come across this with mostly special collections items and am a bit unsure how to properly catalog these types of books.
<br>
> <br>
> When you have two books with completely different bindings and the text blocks are identical, would you add the binding information to a 563 and add both items on the same record?
<br>
> <br>
> Are there any other fields/notes that you commonly add or would suggest? I haven't really come across this scenario for items that have different dimensions. Other than the binding (sometimes quite different and more elaborate than the other), the text block
and all the publication information matches. <br>
> <br>
> Please let me know if you have any suggestions or can point me in the right direction!<br>
> <br>
> My sincere thanks, <br>
> Sarah Stanhope<br>
> Hirsch Library<br>
> Museum of Fine Arts, Houston<u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<p class="gmail-m_-6450908390019536412xm1170193863176621426xxmsonormal"><span lang="EN-US">-- <u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<p class="gmail-m_-6450908390019536412xm1170193863176621426xxmsonormal"><span lang="EN-US">Randal S. Brandt<u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<p class="gmail-m_-6450908390019536412xm1170193863176621426xxmsonormal"><span lang="EN-US">The Bancroft Library | University of California, Berkeley<u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<p class="gmail-m_-6450908390019536412xm1170193863176621426xxmsonormal"><span lang="EN-US">510.643.2275 | <a href="mailto:rbrandt@berkeley.edu" target="_blank">
rbrandt@berkeley.edu</a><u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<p class="gmail-m_-6450908390019536412xm1170193863176621426xmsonormal"> <span lang="EN-US"><u></u><u></u></span></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal">-- <u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><b><i><span style="font-size:7.5pt;font-family:Arial,sans-serif">Nicholas Sparks, </span></i></b><i><span style="font-size:7.5pt;font-family:Arial,sans-serif">M.Lib, PhD (Cantab)</span></i><u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><a href="https://eur03.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.bsanz.org%2Fpublications%2Fscript-and-print%2F&data=05%7C01%7CKaren.Attar%40london.ac.uk%7C78e7245ee7e146deb7fa08da2a595716%7C185280ba7a0042ea940819eafd13552e%7C0%7C0%7C637868860743812292%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C2000%7C%7C%7C&sdata=BF41KcdyXxW7J%2BFZ2sZ0wTuO%2BslbcgGs4TZcm%2B6%2BEqs%3D&reserved=0" target="_blank"><span style="font-size:7.5pt;font-family:Arial,sans-serif">Reviews
Editor, <i>Script & Print: Bulletin of the Bibliographical Society of Australia and New Zealand</i></span></a><u></u><u></u></p>
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<p class="MsoNormal"><span style="font-size:7.5pt;font-family:Arial,sans-serif;color:rgb(51,51,51)"><a href="https://eur03.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.sydney.edu.au%2Farts%2Fabout%2Four-people%2Facademic-staff%2Fnicholas-sparks.html&data=05%7C01%7CKaren.Attar%40london.ac.uk%7C78e7245ee7e146deb7fa08da2a595716%7C185280ba7a0042ea940819eafd13552e%7C0%7C0%7C637868860743812292%7CUnknown%7CTWFpbGZsb3d8eyJWIjoiMC4wLjAwMDAiLCJQIjoiV2luMzIiLCJBTiI6Ik1haWwiLCJXVCI6Mn0%3D%7C2000%7C%7C%7C&sdata=s4D0VPxsvwT2B2uJqoadERsKFjuhiPJRbSoK8WGKkTM%3D&reserved=0" target="_blank">Honorary
Associate Medieval and Early Modern Centre, University of Sydney</a></span><u></u><u></u></p>
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</blockquote></div><br clear="all"><div><br></div>-- <br><div dir="ltr" class="gmail_signature"><div dir="ltr"><div><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div dir="ltr"><div>--</div><div>Christine DeZelar-Tiedman </div><div>Cataloging Policies and Practices Librarian | Cataloging, Metadata, & Digitization Services | University of Minnesota Libraries <br>160 Wilson Library | 309 19th Ave. S. | Minneapolis, MN 55455 </div><div><a href="mailto:dezel002@umn.edu" target="_blank">dezel002@umn.edu</a> </div><div>she, her, hers<br></div><div><br><br><br><br></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div></div>