[DCRM-L] FW: Correction Re: DPC: Wording of i/j u/vconversionin DCRM

[Manon Theroux]

The title of Appendix G has "letter forms" [separate words].

I don't think we are trying to determine the "modern" letter form; we
are trying to determine the letter form that fits the pattern of
usage. I'd strike the word "modern".

Finally, the existing text actually reads slightly differently;
copying from DCRM(B) in Cataloger's Desktop:

0G2.2. If the rules for capitalization require converting the letters
i/j or u/v to uppercase or lowercase, follow the pattern of usage in
the publication being described.[footnote 8]

G4.2. As instructed in rule 0G2.2, when the rules for capitalization
require converting i/j or u/v to uppercase or lowercase,[footnote 26]
the cataloger is to follow the pattern of usage in the publication
being described.

-Manon

On Wed, Dec 8, 2010 at 12:08 PM, Erin Blake <EBlake at folger.edu> wrote:
> New new proposed change, in response to Bob's comments about the word
> "graph":
>
>
>
> 0G2.2./G4.2. If the rules for capitalization require converting the letters
> i/j or u/v to uppercase or lowercase I or V to lowercase, or i, j, u, or v
> to uppercase, follow the pattern of usage in the text to determine which
> modern letterform to use.
>
>
>
> Plain-text version of the above, if the crossings-out and underlinings don’t
> show up for you:
>
>
>
> EXISTING: If the rules for capitalization require converting the letters i/j
> or u/v to uppercase or lowercase, follow the pattern of usage in the text.
>
>
>
> PROPOSED: If the rules for capitalization require converting the letters I
> or V to lowercase, or i, j, u, or v to uppercase, follow the pattern of
> usage in the text to determine which modern letterform to use.
>
>
>
>    EB.
>
>
>
>
>
> From: dcrm-l-bounces at lib.byu.edu [mailto:dcrm-l-bounces at lib.byu.edu] On
> Behalf Of Erin Blake
> Sent: Wednesday, December 08, 2010 12:04 PM
> To: DCRM Revision Group List
> Subject: Re: [DCRM-L] FW: Correction Re: DPC: Wording of i/j u/vconversionin
> DCRM
>
>
>
> Phrase is found in two places: 0G2.2 and G4.2  (same number in both (B) and
> (S))
>
>
>
>    EB.
>
>
>
> From: dcrm-l-bounces at lib.byu.edu [mailto:dcrm-l-bounces at lib.byu.edu] On
> Behalf Of Deborah J. Leslie
> Sent: Wednesday, December 08, 2010 11:49 AM
> To: DCRM Revision Group List
> Subject: Re: [DCRM-L] FW: Correction Re: DPC: Wording of i/j u/v
> conversionin DCRM
>
>
>
> Rule number of proposed change?
>
>
>
> From: dcrm-l-bounces at lib.byu.edu [mailto:dcrm-l-bounces at lib.byu.edu] On
> Behalf Of Erin Blake
> Sent: Wednesday, 08 December, 2010 11:33
> To: DCRM Revision Group List
> Subject: Re: [DCRM-L] FW: Correction Re: DPC: Wording of i/j u/vconversionin
> DCRM
>
>
>
> New proposed change, formatted as HTML with crossed-out and underlined text
> (see below for version all in plain text, if your e-mail client doesn’t show
> HTML):
>
>
>
> If the rules for capitalization require converting the letters i/j or u/v to
> uppercase or lowercase I or V to lowercase, or i, j, u, or v to uppercase,
> follow the pattern of usage in the text to determine which graph to use.
>
>
>
> Plain-text version of the above, if the crossings-out and underlinings don’t
> show up for you:
>
>
>
> EXISTING: If the rules for capitalization require converting the letters i/j
> or u/v to uppercase or lowercase, follow the pattern of usage in the text.
>
>
>
> PROPOSED: If the rules for capitalization require converting the letters I
> or V to lowercase, or i, j, u, or v to uppercase, follow the pattern of
> usage in the text to determine which graph to use.
>
>
>
>     EB.
>
>
>
> From: dcrm-l-bounces at lib.byu.edu [mailto:dcrm-l-bounces at lib.byu.edu] On
> Behalf Of Deborah J. Leslie
> Sent: Wednesday, December 08, 2010 11:21 AM
> To: DCRM Revision Group List
> Subject: Re: [DCRM-L] FW: Correction Re: DPC: Wording of i/j u/v
> conversionin DCRM
>
>
>
> Sounds good. Can you do a better-and-after textual comparison?
>
>
>
> From: dcrm-l-bounces at lib.byu.edu [mailto:dcrm-l-bounces at lib.byu.edu] On
> Behalf Of Erin Blake
> Sent: Wednesday, 08 December, 2010 09:53
> To: DCRM Revision Group List
> Subject: Re: [DCRM-L] FW: Correction Re: DPC: Wording of i/j u/v
> conversioninDCRM
>
>
>
> Thinking about this some more (and with apologies to Deborah, since she’s
> not in her office, and I can’t talk with her in person first) I’m back to
> thinking the existing wording isn’t fine: "If the rules for capitalization
> require converting the letters i/j or u/v to uppercase or lowercase, follow
> the pattern of usage in the text” is technically correct, but misleading.
> Yes, follow the pattern of use: if J needs to be converted to lowercase, the
> pattern of use happens to always be J > j so it’s very easy to determine.
> But it’s also true that patterns of use show A > a, B > b, and so on.
> Mentioning J and U at all, when there’s nothing special about them, is
> confusing.
>
>
>
> “If the rules for capitalization require converting the letters I or V to
> lowercase, or i, j, u, or v to uppercase, follow the pattern of usage in the
> text” is also correct, but clearer. (Especially with the comma added, as
> Margaret Nichols just pointed out).
>
>
>
> Additional possibility: expand the sentence to clarify that conversion of
> case will sometimes, but not always, involve changing the graph. That’s the
> point of DCRM(B) 0G2.2, but it doesn’t explicitly say so. In other words,
> change it to: “If the rules for capitalization require converting the
> letters I or V to lowercase, or i, j, u, or v to uppercase, follow the
> pattern of usage in the text to determine which graph to use.”
>
>
>
>     EB.
>
>
>
> From: dcrm-l-bounces at lib.byu.edu [mailto:dcrm-l-bounces at lib.byu.edu] On
> Behalf Of Deborah J. Leslie
> Sent: Tuesday, December 07, 2010 4:18 PM
> To: DCRM Revision Group List
> Subject: [DCRM-L] FW: Correction Re: DPC: Wording of i/j u/v conversion
> inDCRM
>
>
>
> Erin and I just spoke about this. The existing wording is actually just
> fine; some of the confusion in this instance appears to arise the fact that
> there are two types of conversion going on: converting case (e.g., I to i),
> and converting graph while converting case (i.e., V to u).
>
>
>
> Our solution: Add the note that uppercase J or U signals a modern
> distribution in 0G2, to let people know at that point that they don't need
> to look for usage in the text for that particular letter. (Keep in mind that
> distinction of the letter J as its own letter, and of U as its own letter,
> didn't necessarily happen at the same time.) That's probably enough, but if
> people want even more guidance, add to the table "Uppercase letter to be
> converted" in Appendix G: J à j and U à u
>
> _________________________
> Deborah J. Leslie, M.A., M.L.S.
> RBMS past chair 2010-2011 | Head of Cataloging, Folger Shakespeare Library
> 201 East Capitol St., S.E. | Washington, D.C. 20003 | 202.675-0369
> djleslie at folger.edu | http://www.folger.edu
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> From: dcrm-l-bounces at lib.byu.edu [mailto:dcrm-l-bounces at lib.byu.edu] On
> Behalf Of Erin Blake
> Sent: Tuesday, 07 December, 2010 15:48
> To: dcrm-l at lib.byu.edu
> Subject: [DCRM-L] DPC: Wording of i/j u/v conversion in DCRM
>
>
>
> Last DPC of the season, if we're sticking to one a week: As some of you
> know, this came up at the BSC meeting at Annual, when it became clear that
> there was confusion about the phrase "If the rules for capitalization
> require converting the letters i/j or u/v to uppercase or lowercase..."
> because, in fact, "uppercase or lowercase" aren't reciprocal here. It will
> never be the case that an uppercase J or U will be converted to lowercase,
> see footnote 26 in Appendix G, which reads "An uppercase J or U in the
> source signals a modern distribution, in which i and j are functioning as
> separate letters, as are u and v, requiring no special consideration while
> converting case."
>
>
>
> Proposed change: replace the standard phrase as follows...
>
> Existing wording: If the rules for capitalization require converting the
> letters i/j or u/v to uppercase or lowercase.
>
> New wording: If the rules for capitalization require converting the letters
> I or V to lowercase or i, j, u, or v to uppercase.
>
>
>
> Discussion is open to anyone through DCRM-L for one week. BSC members will
> be asked to vote on the proposed change on December 14.
>
>
>
> Thanks,
>
>
>
>     EB.
>
>
>
> --------------------------------------------------
>
> Erin C. Blake, Ph.D.  |  Curator of Art & Special Collections  |  Folger
> Shakespeare Library  |  201 E. Capitol St. SE  | Washington, DC 20003-1004
> |  office tel. (202) 675-0323  |  fax:  (202) 675-0328  | eblake at folger.edu
> |  www.folger.edu
>
>