[DCRM-L] Title and Statement of Responsibility Area

[lcreider at lib.nmsu.edu]

Bob's example, however, is a very clear-cut example of a phrase that is
grammatically inseparable.  The phrase "prologo del Exmo Sr. D. Manuel Fraga
Iribarne" without the prepositional contraction "del"  (prologo Exmo Sr. D.
Manuel Fraga Iribarne) is not very clear, nor can one understand "del" without
"Sr."  

Here is something to shoot at (I'm not very happy with this, but perhaps someone
can build a clearer and more concise definition).

A "grammatically inseparable" phrase or word seems to mean a grammatical
structure that cannot be construed without the phrase or word in question.  The
phrase or word may  not be intelligible without the basic grammatical structure,
but that is not relevant.  I believe that catalogers can figure this out most of
the time, but there are times when the matter is unclear (ablative or nominative
absolutes in Latin, some participial constructions).

Larry Creider

Deborah J. Leslie" <DJLeslie at FOLGER.edu>:

> I don’t think Bob’s example fits what we’re talking about because the issue
> we’re discussing is qualifications that follow the name (1E8), not terms of
> address (1E7.)
> 
>  
> 
> I disagree that “grammatically necessary” is more meaningful than
> “grammatically inseparable;” it’s wobblier, open to more interpretation.
> Picking up on Larry’s email (which I haven’t digested yet, only glanced at),
> perhaps we could put something  in the glossary. “Grammatically inseparable”
> means that whatever is transcribed stands on its own grammatically according
> to the case endings, &c. “John Smith” does  stand on its own, and so “John
> Smith” of the phrase “John Smith of the Royal Society” is grammatically
> independent, which means in turn that “of the Royal Society” may be omitted
> (although as Manon and I both indicated, it is not best practice to do so).
> 
> 
>  
> 
> OR, I wonder if we should be using some variation of the term “syntactically
> necessary?” If my understanding of the meaning of “syntax” is correct, then
> this is a more specific description. Does it get at, and get at better, what
> we’re trying to achieve, which is to permit “of the Royal Society” to be
> omitted using the mark of omission? 
> 
> __________________________________________ 
> Deborah J. Leslie, M.A., M.L.S.
> Chair, RBMS Bibliographic Standards Committee
> http://www.folger.edu/bsc/index.html
> Head of Cataloging, Folger Shakespeare Library
> 201 East Capitol St., S.E., Washington, D.C. 20003 
> djleslie at folger.edu || 202.675-0369 || http://www.folger.edu   
> 
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Robert Maxwell [mailto:robert_maxwell at byu.edu] 
> Sent: 06 October 2006 11:22
> To: Manon Theroux; jxa16 at psulias.psu.edu; joeas at goshen.edu; Deborah J.
> Leslie; rbrandt at library.berkeley.edu; auc1 at psulias.psu.edu; skuce at mit.edu;
> jane.gillis at yale.edu; juliet at ucrac1.ucr.edu; jfletchr at library.ucla.edu;
> erob at loc.gov
> Cc: DCRM Revision Group List
> Subject: RE: [DCRM-L] Title and Statement of Responsibility Area
> 
>  
> 
> The example in AACR2  1.1F7 is an excellent example of grammatically
> inseparable (though AACR2 calls it "necessary grammatically"): "proìlogo del
> Excmo. Sr. D. Manuel Fraga Iribarne". The title is "Excmo. Sr." (and maybe
> "D."? For the sake of argument let's say it is). "del" is not part of the
> title--at least the preposition part and I would argue that the article part
> isn't either. So if you left the title out you would wind up with "proìlogo
> del Manuel Fraga Iribarne," which doesn't make sense. I.e. it is
> grammatically inseparable--can't be separated from the phrase without making
> a grammatical mess. 
> 
>  
> 
> I agree "of the Royal Society" is not an example of "grammatically
> inseparable" (or for that matter "necessary grammatically"). As Manon
> mentions, were also thinking of places where case endings come into play, but
> that wasn't all.
> 
>  
> 
> Robert L. Maxwell
> Special Collections and Ancient Languages Catalog Librarian
> Genre/Form Authorities Librarian
> 6728 Harold B. Lee Library
> Brigham Young University
> Provo, UT 84602
> (801)422-5568 
> 
>  
> 
>