[DCRM-L] Signature marks that include parentheses

[Noble, Richard]

I respectfully disagree with Deborah. The result of routine use of
placeholders (especially for more than one set of symbols, as could well
occur) will result in a formula that is uninterpretable without annotation.
The inconvenience of that, to my mind, far outweighs the inconvenience of
the occasional odd string, which will be understood by those who need to
understand it, and unnecessarily distances us from best practices of
descriptive bibliography, not unlike those silly, multi-syllabic expanded
terms in RDA.

RICHARD NOBLE :: RARE MATERIALS CATALOGUER :: JOHN HAY LIBRARY
BROWN UNIVERSITY  ::  PROVIDENCE, R.I. 02912  ::  401-863-1187
<Richard_Noble at Br <RICHARD_NOBLE at BROWN.EDU>own.edu>


On Mon, Aug 11, 2014 at 4:17 PM, Deborah J. Leslie <DJLeslie at folger.edu>
wrote:

>  Thanks, Manon; I agree with John that having a placeholder like "symbol"
> that has to be defined would be very helpful, and hugely preferable to
> ):(4 (-):(4)(however much the added spaces help. (-;)
>
>
>
>
>
> Deborah J. Leslie | Folger Shakespeare Library | djleslie at folger.edu |
> 202.675-0369 | 201 East Capitol St., SE, Washington, DC 20003 | www.
> folger.edu
>
>
>
> *From:* dcrm-l-bounces at lib.byu.edu [mailto:dcrm-l-bounces at lib.byu.edu] *On
> Behalf Of *JOHN LANCASTER
> *Sent:* Saturday, 09 August 2014 18:01
> *To:* DCRM Users' Group
> *Subject:* Re: [DCRM-L] Signature marks that include parentheses
>
>
>
> I like the idea of having a generic placeholder, whether “[symbol]” or
> something else, that always has to be defined in a note.  It would be
> useful whenever any odd symbol turns up in a collation.
>
>
>
> In many cases, the placeholder+definition would be used for a signature
> that can’t be reproduced at all; it should be allowable even if the
> separate pieces might be available in the character set, when it would be
> difficult, as in this case, to make a clearly readable statement following
> the normal form of the formula.
>
>
>
> I don’t like using only part of the signature to stand for the whole -
> that seems more difficult to understand and potentially misleading.
>
>
>
> John Lancaster
>
>
>
>
>
> On Aug 9, 2014, at 5:46 PM, Manon Théroux <manon.theroux at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>
>   Could you take one of the following approaches?:
>
>
>
> Signatures: [symbol]4-([symbol]4); the symbol is a colon surrounded by
> inverted parentheses: ):(
>
>
>
> Signatures: :4(-:4); colons enclosed by inverted parentheses.
>
>
>
> Signatures: [colon]4(-[colon]4); colons printed within inverted
> parentheses: ):(
>
>
>
> Manon
>
>
> On Aug 8, 2014, at 3:34 PM, "Young, Stephen" <stephen.young at yale.edu>
> wrote:
>
> Eileen Smith, who has served as a lab assistant for Advanced Descriptive
> Bibliography at Rare Book School,  suggested to me that inserting a space
> would help to clarify things in these situations. Your example would become:
>
>
>
> ):(4 (-):(4)
>
>
>
> This is what I have been doing lately. The space helps the eyes a little
> bit.
>
>
>
> Stephen R. Young
>
> Rare Book Catalog Librarian
>
> Beinecke Rare Book & Manuscript Library
>
> P.O. Box 208240
>
> New Haven, CT 06520-8240
>
> Tel.: 203-432-8385
>
> Email: stephen.young at yale.edu
>
> The Beinecke Rare Book & Manuscript Library will close for a major
> renovation in May 2015, reopening in August 2016.  We will maintain a
> reading room in Sterling Memorial Library during this time, but access to
> various collections will be limited as early as April 2014 while we prepare
> for closure. For details, please visit o
> <http://beineckelibraryrenovation.yale.edu/>ur renovation website
> <http://beineckelibraryrenovation.yale.edu/>.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> *From:* dcrm-l-bounces at lib.byu.edu [mailto:dcrm-l-bounces at lib.byu.edu
> <dcrm-l-bounces at lib.byu.edu>] *On Behalf Of *Deborah J. Leslie
> *Sent:* Friday, August 08, 2014 3:27 PM
> *To:* DCRM Users' Group
> *Subject:* [DCRM-L] Signature marks that include parentheses
>
>
>
> *Formatting present: best read in html or RTF *
>
>
>
> Dear colleagues,
>
>
>
> Jason LeMay, an alumnus of this year's RBS Rare Book Cataloging course,
> sent me a query about recording the signature mark *):( * With his
> permission, I'm reposting it and a version of my response below for
> discussion.
>
> I am finally trying to put my Rare Book Cataloging into action. I’ve come
> across an odd little pamphlet I had previously dealt with, and now I’m
> preparing to review and enhance my previous cataloging. The entire item is
> a single gathering of four leaves, and they are signed “):(“, “):(2”, and
> “):(3” (fourth leaf unsigned).
>
> For the signature, would I actually record ):(4?
>
> DJL:
>
> Jason, yes, you’ve got it right. Since our character set has parentheses
> and a colon, you can use them to represent the signature mark.
>
> The difficulty comes when you need to qualify signatures. Parentheses are
> used to introduce the qualifications, but when the signature mark also has
> parentheses, the resulting statement can be almost impossible to parse.
> Let’s imagine that the gathering in your book wasn’t regular and needed to
> be qualified. Say, that the gathering only has three leaves, you’ve
> ascertained that the fourth leaf isn’t present, and that your 3-leaf
> gathering represents a perfect copy.
>
> Signatures: ):(4(-):(4) A-Z8.
>
> I’ve resorted to a couple of different ways to ameliorate the situation.
> One is to use square brackets and an extra space instead of parentheses for
> qualification. So:
>
> Signatures: ):(4 [-):(4] A-Z8.
>
> Which is still enough to make one’s eyes cross.
>
> What do you, the community, think about this use of a descriptive phrase
> in the following signature statement for an actual book.
>
> Signatures: [inverted parentheses]-3[inverted parentheses]4 4[inverted
> parentheses]4 (-[inverted parentheses]4) A-C4 D4 (±D1) E4 F4 (±F1) G-3H4
> 3I4 (-3I4).
>
> This book is signed with *)(* instead of* ):(*, so "inverted parentheses"
> is accurate. For the latter, one possible remedy I just thought of was to
> pick a single character to represent the ):( and explain it. Something like
>
>
> Signatures: %-3%4 4%4(-%4) A-C4 D4 (±D1) E4 F4 (±F1) G-3H4 3I4(-3I4);
> preliminaries are actually signed ):(.
>
>
>
> Deborah J. Leslie | Folger Shakespeare Library | djleslie at folger.edu |
> 202.675-0369 | 201 East Capitol St., SE, Washington, DC 20003 | www.
> folger.edu
>
>
>
>
>
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